[_detox]

So my drummer and I have been deliberating on this subject for a bit now.

I just rediscovered The Walk by Periphery and remembered how good it is. The rhythms contained within this song are too good to be true and I think that Bulb has a secret scroll passed down by the Scandinavian ancestors on how to write such amazing rhythmic music.

ANYWAYS, apart from stealing that scroll, how do you guys who write music in the vein of Meshuggah and Textures and whatnot go about doing it? I'm sure after a while your brain starts to think of ideas by itself, but how exactly did you get into writing shit like this? Assimilating the Meshuggah discography so that you can play it backwards and forwards from memory?

thankzmuch.

[neon_black88]

Bulb is a bit more random than meshuggah sometimes and doesnt actually strictly follow a poly rhythm. As far as my knowledge goes anyway. I guitar pro'ed icarus lives for example which has more parts where you have to memorise the whole rhythm because it doesnt cycle, it just keeps changing.

Meshuggah do that as well but more often there is a pattern that resycles mid bar, the starts up again, recycles, then wait for the obligatory complete restart of the previous 4 - 8 bars.

A good way to start would be to get a program like guitar pro, write a riff in 7/8 but fit it into a 4/4 meter. So the first time the patern ends it will be 1 8th note away from the end of the bar and it will start again ON the 8th note. Keep going like that but it will start and stop in different places within the bar each time, and when you get to 4 or 8 bars or whatever, restart the whole thing from the 1st bar. Then bring up a drum track and put a high hat on every 1 2 3 4, and a snare on every 2 and 4. Then copy the rhythm of the guitar with the kick pedals.

I hope that makes sense

Thats the real basic's of it, you might know it alreaddy but someone might not. People feel free to correct me or add more, thats just my understanding of a simple polyrhythm.

[stuh84]

As mentioned, the Guitar Pro idea is a good one. I've come up with a lot by just randomly putting something in the drums, say 3 kicks and 2 rests in semiquavers, and repeat until it resolves back to the start. Add a cymbal on every beat, and a snare on every 3rd beat, instant Meshuggah/Periphery/Textures style riff.

You almost have to think in numbers more than you think compositionally in them senses. Hence why it can sound quite robotic at times, but if that is what you are going for, thats one of the best ways to do it.

[neon_black88]

Its best to think numbers wise in the beggining anyway. You can pull way away from that later on, but you need a strong foundation to build off and the best way to build a foundation is to understand it.

And ofcourse the reason guitar pro is a good idea is because the whole thing that is going to turn that 7/8 riff into a polyrhtyhm is drums, or another instrument. You could theoretically play a one on a single guitar, if you had masterfull finger picking or hybrid picking. But if your going in the meshuggah vain, you really need to hear the drums and guitar together.

[_detox]

Originally Posted by neon_black88

Bulb is a bit more random than meshuggah sometimes and doesnt actually strictly follow a poly rhythm. As far as my knowledge goes anyway. I guitar pro'ed icarus lives for example which has more parts where you have to memorise the whole rhythm because it doesnt cycle, it just keeps changing.

Meshuggah do that as well but more often there is a pattern that resycles mid bar, the starts up again, recycles, then wait for the obligatory complete restart of the previous 4 - 8 bars.

A good way to start would be to get a program like guitar pro, write a riff in 7/8 but fit it into a 4/4 meter. So the first time the patern ends it will be 1 8th note away from the end of the bar and it will start again ON the 8th note. Keep going like that but it will start and stop in different places within the bar each time, and when you get to 4 or 8 bars or whatever, restart the whole thing from the 1st bar. Then bring up a drum track and put a high hat on every 1 2 3 4, and a snare on every 2 and 4. Then copy the rhythm of the guitar with the kick pedals.

I hope that makes sense

Thats the real basic's of it, you might know it alreaddy but someone might not. People feel free to correct me or add more, thats just my understanding of a simple polyrhythm.

Hey thanks for that example..that's pretty much what I was talking about, I'll definitely try that out.

And I'm not completely talking about polyrhythms, I'm talking about the odd meter and off-beat stuff as well. It's just something that I've never been able to come up with anything like, so I'm curious how you experienced peoples come up with it.

[Stitch]

I love polyrhythms, but I try as much as possible to make them subtle like Necrophagist and whatnot do. Big obvious ones just get boring.

This song by my band starts in 12/8, goes to 11/8 for the last bar into 10/8 for 8 repeats into one bar of 7/4 into 15 bars of 11/8...with cymbal hits reeating ever equivalent 4/4 bar...the final bar is in 8/8 to introduce the new idea in 9/8 before launching intoa riff in 11/8...

The whole song has one section in 4/4, but it doesn't really feel mathematical metal at all.

SoundClick artist: The Katyn Massacre - page with MP3 music downloads

[Stitch]

I know all of that isn't polyrhythm, but a lot of it is odd meter and odd rhythmic groupings.

[Desecrated]

Didn't we have a really long thread that explained all this very good?

[neon_black88]

I love polyrhythms, but I try as much as possible to make them subtle like Necrophagist and whatnot do. Big obvious ones just get boring.

Yeah while necrophagist like you say arn't really polyrhythmic, they do the odd meter stuff really well and it flows perfectly. Its always a good idea to make it as seamless as possibly and not really jarring. Unless ofcourse you going for that particular feel.

Polyrhythms just groove in a way normal riffs can't though and thats what makes them awsome. Necrophagist have really cool grooves in their stuff too. Like the 2nd riff in Intestinal incubation. Alot of their stuff fits pretty nicely into a 4/4 kind of setting though.

[Stitch]

The intro of Seven is an incredible example of polyrhythm.