Bands that you believe have sold out...

[TankJon666]

Originally Posted by Loomer

Arch Enemy. From fairly decent melodeath to super-boring entry level metal with a stupid ....ing "WHOA HEY LOOK AT US WE HAVE A CHICK SINGER!"-gimmick. Yeah, you have a woman in the band LIKE OTHER BANDS HAVE HAD FOR DECADES, you really are special snowflakes. Great.

COB. They sucked from the get-go IMO, but the recent stuff is just hair metal for angsty teens.

In Flames. Well, this goes without saying, doesn't it!?

And now the other end:

Bolt Thrower.. This band is one of the only bands that can have a shirt that says "In A World of Compromise, Some Don't" and back it up the whole way. They never, ever let their fans down, and stick to their principles. The music has never lost quality, since they can rightfully claim to have no duds in their back catalogues, and their policy of always keeping merch and ticket prices down further cements this. Also, they've had a female member all the way (the mighty Jo Bench), but have never, ever used that as a cheap gimmick unlike some other bands.

Napalm Death. Still as pissed-off today as always, and manage to straddle the line between sticking to what works and still experimenting and expanding their sound, in the most elegant manner possible.

Napalm Death just get angrier with each release. Awesome.

[bhakan]

Originally Posted by Oxidation_Shed

I always find selling out a hot topic in music. The thing is, musician is probably the only career where people think that it's a bad thing when you do better.
This is their vocation, in some cases their main method of financial support and we find it acceptable to wish them to write music with less appeal (and therefore make less money). If that was any other career, wishing bad luck on someone would consider unacceptable.
It's the band's business and if their business decision is to try and go for a wider audience at risk of alienating their old fans, well that's up to them. Just as if they decide to try a new style, much to the lament of their old fanbase, it's up to them.

I'm not going to go purchase a copy of Sounds of a Playground fading by In Flames to add to my collection, because I don't like it. But I'm not going to sit behind my computer screen and complain about it either.

At some level, unless you're a one man band who never listens to anyone's feedback, all music being created is based to a degree on the opinion of someone else.

So what if a band I love makes a record I dislike that appeals to a wider audience? I'll listen to the albums I like, wish them every success with their careers and find another band from the limitless number of talented ensembles out there to get into.

I don't think it is that different from any other business. If a company cuts corners in the production and makes a lower quality product to make more money, people often dislike like it and complain just like we complain when a band releases what we deem a "lower quality" album.

Also, I'd bet that not every band that switches to more accessible music is selling out, a lot of them may have just matured or changed to the point where they no longer want to play what they used to. We seem to often think that the only reason people would ever want to write accessible music is to get more money. Regardless, I respect a bands decisions over their music. If they sell out, good for them, they can probably live comfortably now.

[fps]

Originally Posted by Oxidation_Shed

I always find selling out a hot topic in music. The thing is, musician is probably the only career where people think that it's a bad thing when you do better.
This is their vocation, in some cases their main method of financial support and we find it acceptable to wish them to write music with less appeal (and therefore make less money). If that was any other career, wishing bad luck on someone would consider unacceptable.
It's the band's business and if their business decision is to try and go for a wider audience at risk of alienating their old fans, well that's up to them. Just as if they decide to try a new style, much to the lament of their old fanbase, it's up to them.

I'm not going to go purchase a copy of Sounds of a Playground fading by In Flames to add to my collection, because I don't like it. But I'm not going to sit behind my computer screen and complain about it either.

At some level, unless you're a one man band who never listens to anyone's feedback, all music being created is based to a degree on the opinion of someone else.

So what if a band I love makes a record I dislike that appeals to a wider audience? I'll listen to the albums I like, wish them every success with their careers and find another band from the limitless number of talented ensembles out there to get into.

Good luck to bands who become popular, they leave many bitter people in their wake though.

[Lern2swim]

The concept of "selling out" is one of the most utterly idiotic things bestowed upon this earth by "music fans." People change; that also means that bands change. They grow up, find new influences, learn new things, etc. That means that there is always a likelihood that their sound will change too. Sometimes it will be great and sometimes it will suck (and this is my problem with newer Mudvayne. Not that they've sold out, but that most of it is just not that good). That's it. Barring evidence that a band has literally taken a chunk of change from whomever in order to release music that they didn't want to release, there is NO selling out.

That's why the Machine Head example irks the .... out of me. They were influenced by what was going on with music at the time. So the .... what??? Guess what, those albums they released during that period were still really good ....ing albums (sorry, if you can't admit that, then there's no hope for you), and that's all that matters.

So, anyone who is so obsessed with some imaginary metal street cred that they put it before the actual music can .... off and stick their ....ing finger up their ass (refer to 1st page)

[Loomer]

Originally Posted by TankJon666

Napalm Death just get angrier with each release. Awesome.

Getting old and cranky does that to a person

[Dan_Vacant]

Originally Posted by M3CHK1LLA

i think we may find that the punk fans will tend to be a little more harsh on their bands than most other ppl

if you did look at it from a punk prospective Sex Pistols, Romones and my favorite punk band The Misfits and alot more, so much more.

[Dan_Vacant]

Originally Posted by Lern2swim

The concept of "selling out" is one of the most utterly idiotic things bestowed upon this earth by "music fans." People change; that also means that bands change. They grow up, find new influences, learn new things, etc. That means that there is always a likelihood that their sound will change too. Sometimes it will be great and sometimes it will suck (and this is my problem with newer Mudvayne. Not that they've sold out, but that most of it is just not that good). That's it. Barring evidence that a band has literally taken a chunk of change from whomever in order to release music that they didn't want to release, there is NO selling out.

That's why the Machine Head example irks the .... out of me. They were influenced by what was going on with music at the time. So the .... what??? Guess what, those albums they released during that period were still really good ....ing albums (sorry, if you can't admit that, then there's no hope for you), and that's all that matters.

So, anyone who is so obsessed with some imaginary metal street cred that they put it before the actual music can .... off and stick their ....ing finger up their ass (refer to 1st page)

Even though I have posted in here I whole heartedly agree with this.

[poopyalligator]

So back in the day I was really into offspring. I loved the punk sound that they had. I heard a new song of theirs on the radio, and it went a little something like this-



Clearly they have changed their sound a lot lol.

[GuitaristOfHell]

Disturbed. They lost it after ten thousand fists.

[Explorer]

I've been thinking about this now for a few days, and I like the idea of a band buying back in. *laugh*

In other words, a band can go from doing something you don't like to something you do.

A nearby topic doesn't quite put this on the listener, saying that a band changed to the listener's tastes, but instead just asks for bands which got "better over time."

Bands who have gotten better overtime ?

What I like is the easy-to-overlook assertion: "got better over time" actually means "you like it more," so "better" just means "more to your personal tastes."

Really, the fact is that over time bands/performers don't always move in the same direction as their listeners, and often not even in the same direction as their bandmates.

Saying that a band sucks or got better only means that they did so in relation to your tiny private universe.

[HOKENSTYFE]

One band that is nothing but a big bag of sellout...HellYeah. Their new album, their trying to buy back in. And I got a feeling that will rub off on a new Mudvayne, buy back in record. Corey 'captain sellout' Taylor. Everything Stone Sour.

The 'Bum Juice Tour', Hellyeah & Stone Sour with special guests Metallica playing their St. Anger album backwards.

[M3CHK1LLA]

i guess the upside to a band changing their sound is that there are about 50 other bands who were influenced by them, ready to fill in the void...

...or some may call that jumping on the bandwagon

[lucasreis]

Originally Posted by Lern2swim

The concept of "selling out" is one of the most utterly idiotic things bestowed upon this earth by "music fans." People change; that also means that bands change. They grow up, find new influences, learn new things, etc. That means that there is always a likelihood that their sound will change too. Sometimes it will be great and sometimes it will suck (and this is my problem with newer Mudvayne. Not that they've sold out, but that most of it is just not that good). That's it. Barring evidence that a band has literally taken a chunk of change from whomever in order to release music that they didn't want to release, there is NO selling out.

That's why the Machine Head example irks the .... out of me. They were influenced by what was going on with music at the time. So the .... what??? Guess what, those albums they released during that period were still really good ....ing albums (sorry, if you can't admit that, then there's no hope for you), and that's all that matters.

So, anyone who is so obsessed with some imaginary metal street cred that they put it before the actual music can .... off and stick their ....ing finger up their ass (refer to 1st page)

This is the ultimate comment. Really.

The whole "oh I'm a metal fan, I have cred, .... bullshit sellouts" attitude is ....ing moronic and just as sheep-ish as the attitude of some pop fans. Real fans of music don't really care if something is popular or not. It's all about appreciating musicianship. Bravo!!

[Mark Lewis]

Avenged Sevenfold
Eighteen Visions
Atreyu
KoRn
Slipknot
Your Demise

I think the worst ones are the ones who kick a member out (i.e vocalist) for a more radio friendly direction, or just make poor excuses for it...Just be honest with your fans...just say "We've made 4 albums, we've run out of things to write about and whislt it was great having freedom...it didn't pay well enough for us to retire and I don't fancy working at mcdonalds soon because I have no qualifications. So we're going to put out some more albums with the view to getting more airplay...We'll try not to differ TOO much...but don't worry we'll still play the old stuff at shows."

THAT...for me....Would make me respect them a hell of a lot more, because then you an think "Well, I've had my time with them.....let other people enjoy them now" and you have closure.

DON'T keep telling people it's your heaviest album yet and then release the metal equivalent to a pop punk album...That's just inciting hatred...

Honesty is the best policy kids...

[ArtDecade]

If selling out means being rich, than slap my picture on a coffin and call me Kiss!

[Eric Christian]

Originally Posted by The Uncreator

Some fans are selfish enough to think musicians make music for them. They are artists, and we are lucky enough to be a part of what they create.

Lucky? lol... Thats funny because I've never seen a headline "Unknown Rock Musician Dies, Entire Catalog of Previously Undiscovered Hits Found!"

So yeah, your statement seems completely illogical because if that was the case then you would have never heard of the artist in the first place if it wasn't for their own ego and need for validation. Throughout history there have been a few reclusive artists who specialized in fine art such as sculpture and oil painting for example who sequestered their work for their entire lives. However, this has never been the case in Rock Music. The entire music business is driven by fans and if you're a musician and you want a paycheck then your fans are important.

[Equivoke]

Originally Posted by Lern2swim

The concept of "selling out" is one of the most utterly idiotic things bestowed upon this earth by "music fans." People change; that also means that bands change. They grow up, find new influences, learn new things, etc. That means that there is always a likelihood that their sound will change too. Sometimes it will be great and sometimes it will suck (and this is my problem with newer Mudvayne. Not that they've sold out, but that most of it is just not that good). That's it. Barring evidence that a band has literally taken a chunk of change from whomever in order to release music that they didn't want to release, there is NO selling out.

That's why the Machine Head example irks the .... out of me. They were influenced by what was going on with music at the time. So the .... what??? Guess what, those albums they released during that period were still really good ....ing albums (sorry, if you can't admit that, then there's no hope for you), and that's all that matters.

So, anyone who is so obsessed with some imaginary metal street cred that they put it before the actual music can .... off and stick their ....ing finger up their ass (refer to 1st page)

/thread
/thread

[Oxidation_Shed]

Originally Posted by bhakan

I don't think it is that different from any other business. If a company cuts corners in the production and makes a lower quality product to make more money, people often dislike like it and complain just like we complain when a band releases what we deem a "lower quality" album.

Making a bad album and "selling out" aren't the same thing.

Yeah it bothers me when a band make an album that I don't like and flops commercially. But music is subjective and if a band "sells out" and makes an album that the old fans don't like, but brings them to a much wider audience granting them previously unachieved levels of commercial success, I don't see how someone can say that album is "worse" than anything else they've done.

[bhakan]

Originally Posted by Oxidation_Shed

Making a bad album and "selling out" aren't the same thing.

Yeah it bothers me when a band make an album that I don't like and flops commercially. But music is subjective and if a band "sells out" and makes an album that the old fans don't like, but brings them to a much wider audience granting them previously unachieved levels of commercial success, I don't see how someone can say that album is "worse" than anything else they've done.

I agree, that's why i didn't say make a worse album, but "what we deem as" a worse album. Obviously music is subjective, but for the taste of most people here, "selling out" results in subjectively worse music.

[M3CHK1LLA]

^ there are many examples of bands with awesome albums quickly followed by a stinker...

[hairychris]

Originally Posted by M3CHK1LLA

^ there are many examples of bands with awesome albums quickly followed by a stinker...

Ah yes, especially the case of the awesome first album followed by shitty 2nd.

That is not entirely the band's fault. First album will often consist of songs that have had years of getting right in demos, live settings, etc. Sales go well, record label want a follow-up a year later, band has to learn to write music under pressure, failure often ensues as not everyone can do that. You can often see this happen when the 3rd and subsequent albums get better. Other songwriters are naturally quick so don't have this problem as much.

[estabon37]

My experience as a huge Pearl Jam fan makes me kinda surprised nobody has mentioned them yet. I'm always surprised when I'm asked by someone what I listen to and I reply "Pearl Jam" to be immediately rebuffed by what a pack of sellouts they always were. It doesn't take long for me to find out I'm talking to a Nirvana fan who has never listened to any Pearl Jam beyond hearing a couple of songs off Ten.

The main reason it's strange is that they fall into the "buying back in" category. Ten is their first album, their most commercial for its time of release, and was my least favourite album by them until it was remixed a couple of years ago. All that horrible reverb was removed, and all of a sudden the band sounded like they do on all of their other albums! Their albums Vs through Yield seemed to deliberately distance the band from the "generic" grunge sound of the early 90s, and this is a band that is constantly labelled as sellouts because ... well, they made a ....ton of money. They are also one of the few bands from that decade who went out of their way to maintain legal, artistic and distributive control of their albums alongside Tool, who had to go to court for five years to do it.

tl/dr: Pearl Jam are as far from sellouts as you'll ever see. For a band who actively tried to sell out and failed hard, check out Live's albums after The Distance to Here. It's almost funny.

[oompa]

The problem with Metallica selling out is not that they're making money.

It's not like they weren't making money back in the late 80's lol

The problem is that it is kind of hard to sing about how you roam around town looking for a fight when you prance around in luxury shopping district for prada caps

What that does is that it makes it hard for me to listen to them anymore and feel that they're genuine.

You write songs about justice and shit and then you pull off the biggest web-trial ever against napster sharing their music freely when they're all at a point where they have their own jet planes.

That does not make you sound like a musician who wants a better society by complaining about drugs, death penalties, injustices, wars etc.

That makes you sound like a self-absorbed idiot who wants every penny that is 'rightfully theirs' even when they're millionaires, and spreading their message is second or maybe third if you're lucky - hence people feel they sold out

At least that is my take on it, and that's why I cringe when I see bands like Metallica or In Flames to take one band from my own country who kind of did the same - at first they were all about being creative - then they were all about getting as much air time as possible on the MTV and getting high sales figures and phat publicity.

However, I am far from bitter, since for every band that 'sells out' in my eyes, i.e. quits making music for the sake of contributing to the wonderful art (that is music), a new band pops up with the right spirit!

Overall I see us going plus minus zero with the side effect that new albums keep popping up that I can listen to, just that different bands make em

[brutus627]

Soilwork...chain heart machine was sick and i feel like ever since predators portrait their stuff has been going the wrong way for me to want anything to do with it
Arsis...forced to rock? No they can't force me to do that, in fact I refuse to to rock that shit
Impending doom...to boring to waste the time anymore
Ion dissonance, minus the herd was VERY boring coming off solace which was a masterpiece but cursed was an improvement tho I will admit...easily more "sellable" though than their early work
Dimmu borgir no longer deliver the goods
Decapitated's songs all run together now they used to be sick ala nihility
Meshuggah...j/k, seeing them live locked them in my number favorite band spot permanently

[Equivoke]

^^^ I feel like you are listing albums which you don't like as much as their predecessors and slapping on the "sold out" tag for whatever reason.

Do you think Minus the Herd or Cursed were "marketable" enough to make a lot of money?