How not to sound like Meshuggah and do it well!

[The Reverend]

Originally Posted by ArkaneDemon

Meshuggah doesn't write good songs, they write good rhythm exercises.

And all of a sudden everyone stopped posting .

This is the first time I've seen SSO speechless.

[Scar Symmetry]

Originally Posted by ArkaneDemon

Meshuggah doesn't write good songs, they write good rhythm exercises.

I don't agree but I see what you're getting at.

[vampiregenocide]

Originally Posted by ArkaneDemon

Meshuggah doesn't write good songs, they write good rhythm exercises.

You're right to an extent, but I also think they are great songs.

[DaethedralXiphos7FX]

My basic beef is that all music is obviously progressive, as it is constantly changing and taking influence and inspiration from various places. I just think that we are truly seeing a change that his making quite the vibrations in prog, metal, and music in general. The virtuosity in young musicians today is prevalent everywhere simply because of the access to modern knowledge. But when it comes to metal, I see Meshuggah. They have made such huge vibrations that the waves are just now hitting us, almost as if they were from the future. But the future can change, that's why we are seeing such great musicianship come from these young bands like (sorry to name drop) Animals As Leaders.

To go back on a previous note. The only reason thrash is still alive is because young adults in their garages are trying to thrash out. The end result are bands like Metallica and Bullet For My Valentine :/

Punk is almost the same way. Look what happened, two directions; went weak like Green Day or Blink 182, or went extreme like Napalm Death/Terrorizer/Pig Destroyer (Grindcore).

Now black metal, of course I know its origins, I grew up in that era. The only real black metal band is Venom or even Bathory. Bands like Burzum or Darkthrone still considered black metal to me in their early days, but all the way to present Cradle of Filth, Dimmu Borgir or Abigail Williams. No black metal is done for.

These are only my opinions, but Meshuggah has indeed made a huge impact in the progressive metal movement. And I am part of it because I draw heavy influence from them and other prog stuff, even if I play death metal.

[brutalwizard]

Originally Posted by DaethedralXiphos7FX

And I am part of it because I draw heavy influence from them and other prog stuff, even if I play death metal.

Originally Posted by brutalwizard

AS DEVIN PUTS IT

"While we all have lots of bands who influence us, still…we all rip off Meshuggah!"

'ed by devy with months of a gap

[yingmin]

Originally Posted by DaethedralXiphos7FX

My basic beef is that all music is obviously progressive, as it is constantly changing and taking influence and inspiration from various places.

This misunderstands the idea of progressive music almost as badly as when people were complaining that emo just meant "emotional".

[DLG]

Originally Posted by ArkaneDemon

Meshuggah doesn't write good songs, they write good rhythm exercises.

no.

Meshuggah have a way of building tension through repetition and constructing a song that no one has been able to replicate, which is what makes them better than every band that has learned how to emulate their riffs. None have been able to duplicate their atmosphere no matter how much their riffs sound like meshuggah and are constructed like meshuggah's theoretically.

[BMU]

A personal YES on the snide Meshuggah rhythm exercises comment. And EVH threw around Holdsworth's name back in 1867 or something. So lot of metal guitarists listened to him "before" Meshuggah.

[Wingchunwarrior]

Originally Posted by DLG

no.

Meshuggah have a way of building tension through repetition and constructing a song that no one has been able to replicate, which is what makes them better than every band that has learned how to emulate their riffs. None have been able to duplicate their atmosphere no matter how much their riffs sound like meshuggah and are constructed like meshuggah's theoretically.

They are my EXACT views on Meshuggah

[ChrisRushing]

The virtuosity in young musicians today is prevalent everywhere simply because of the access to modern knowledge.

I don't think this is even close to accurate. There have ALWAYS been young virtuoso's but until now we have never had the ability to access and view them so easily. Sites like YOUTUBE have really changed it where a completely unknown player can have the world as his audience.
Let's step back 25 years. You don't believe there were any proficient young guitarist in the 80's when it PAID big money to bring the pain on guitar?
What about Mozart.....did his lack of access to modern knowledge stop him from laying other composers to waste in his teens?

[ChrisRushing]

Originally Posted by DLG

no.

Meshuggah have a way of building tension through repetition and constructing a song that no one has been able to replicate, which is what makes them better than every band that has learned how to emulate their riffs. None have been able to duplicate their atmosphere no matter how much their riffs sound like meshuggah and are constructed like meshuggah's theoretically.

Exactly, music isn't just about what notes (or lack of) are coming off the fretboard. The mood/vibe is such a big part of their sound.
They lost me a little bit on their later releases but Destroy Erase Improve is a ....ing tutorial on dynamics. Even though it was released almost 16 years ago I don't think anyone in this same style has even come close to matching it.

[Mindcrime1204]

Originally Posted by BMU

And EVH threw around Holdsworth's name back in 1867 or something. So lot of metal guitarists listened to him "before" Meshuggah.

WAT?

[NaYoN]

Originally Posted by yingmin

This misunderstands the idea of progressive music almost as badly as when people were complaining that emo just meant "emotional".

This. If anything, most Meshuggah songs are "regressive"

[Hemi-Powered Drone]

Originally Posted by Scrubface05

Want something progressive? Go listen to Protest the Hero

I've never heard anyone else that sounds like them, and they're constantly pushing those changes.

[BMU]

Originally Posted by Mindcrime1204

WAT?

What, what? (You said what first. Har.)

Allan Holdsworth - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Van Halen had previously enthused about Holdsworth in a 1980 issue of Guitar Player magazine, saying "That guy is bad! He's fantastic; I love him", and that Holdsworth was "[t]he best, in my book".[3]

Edit - nevermind. This was way back in the thread.

Carry on.
Meshuggah: not just a rhythm exercise band (apparently).

[rythmic_pulses]

What I actually like about Meshuggah is nowadays they tend to keep it kinda simple in their own way of doing things with their repetition which also brings about their array of moods in a certain song, most Djent bands in my area tend to go off and start tapping all over the fretboard and widdling and shit and getting far too technical, it gets repetitive after a while and it all starts to sound the same and I am not bashing any bands here it's just how some people I know have accidently percieved the concept in an entirely wrong way, instead of doing it like Meshuggah do it they tend to get lost in the 'technical' and gear aspect of it all like "Hey check out my Axe FX plus patches,TS9 and my Ibanez RG2228 and now I will djent like Periphery!" which is kinda silly because guys I have met have tried using this setup with their various preamps and still not getting that technique right and going "I thought it was all about the gear?" and when it comes to the technical side the guys I know are fighting where the extreme harmonised tapping section is going to be and then the syncopated rythms over 4/4 with hammer ons and pulloffs.


I personally like the Djent movement and where it is going because it isn't all about that certain sound anymore, most bands in the Genre are getting more and more adventurous with harmony and how it reacts with their playing style so now Djent bands are more of a mix of Meshuggah and Dream Theatre and it is getting more experimental year by year.

But soon Djent will be thrown into the Jazz Fusion category

[Rap Hat]

Originally Posted by rythmic_pulses

But soon Djent will be thrown into the Jazz Fusion category

Djazz Fusion

Funny thing about Meshuggah, Fredrik's been on record stating the jazz influence in his solos. His approach is obviously based more on freeform jazz stylings than more traditional stuff, but you have to wonder if the waves from that are hitting now.

[rythmic_pulses]

Djazz Fusion

but yeah definitely, the free form jazz styling is far more popular now amongst musicians like Fredrik and The Mats Morgan Band, so yeah I guess the waves of influences are being passed over to another generation.

And the way Fredrik answer to the question of how he composes solo's "I don't know I just improvise until it sounds.....cool.....hahaha" that is one of the best ways I have heard a guitarist describe how they compose.

[The_Mop]

Here's my problem for the whole meshuggah/djent scene - for a genre that describes itself as 'progressive', everything is really samey.. it almost seems hilarious when you see these bands chugging along with a steady 4/4 beat going OMG PLYRHYTHMS DERE SO INTERESTIN LULZ AM SO ORIGINAL, almost oblivious to the bigger picture...

Even meshuggah, in my opinion, have become incredibly stagnant. I don't think they've made anything really worth listening to since Nothing. They've no doubt changed the face of metal, in some aspects for the better, but conversely in quite a lot of respects, for the worse.

It's a bit like how death metal is dull as shit because no-one can help ripping off cannibal corpse...

[orakle]

why cant people just find music they like and enjoy it ?

this is ....in ridiculous

[The_Mop]

Tbh, I used to love meshuggah. Thought they were the shit. It's just a shame that they've basically been re-hashing Nothing ever since it came out, now I'm bored of them.

IMO, of course :P

[rythmic_pulses]

Originally Posted by The_Mop

Here's my problem for the whole meshuggah/djent scene - for a genre that describes itself as 'progressive', everything is really samey.. it almost seems hilarious when you see these bands chugging along with a steady 4/4 beat going OMG PLYRHYTHMS DERE SO INTERESTIN LULZ AM SO ORIGINAL, almost oblivious to the bigger picture...

Even meshuggah, in my opinion, have become incredibly stagnant. I don't think they've made anything really worth listening to since Nothing. They've no doubt changed the face of metal, in some aspects for the better, but conversely in quite a lot of respects, for the worse.

It's a bit like how death metal is dull as shit because no-one can help ripping off cannibal corpse...

I agree, there are times when Meshuggah can get a little stagnant but that's what happens when the band members aren't with each other during the writing stages and just sitting at a desktop with a computer emailing ideas to each other and not spending any time as friends for example because it is really easy to get into a really bad routine where you don't rehearse like Meshuggah did lately, but now they have decided this time round for their newest album to get together as a band and write together in a room for the first time since 1998, maybe they thought things were starting to get stagnant in the writing process themselves?.

Death Metal as well has become kinda dull because like you said they are ripping off Cannibal Corpse and not taking any styles from earlier bands like Morbid Angel and Death for example, Deathcore is now far too popular and that is really boring music to listen to, breakdown after breakdown and not musically progressing any further, but don't lose hope in things man cause that's when musically, things die.

Music is coming full circle with older influences branching out into a younger generation, like with me I have started listening to Jazz Fusion artists from the 70's like Al Di Meola and Return to Forever because nowadays there ain't a lot of musicians like that anymore and I find it kinda hard to get any inspiration from musicians like say "Matt Heafy" for a bad example because what he is doing isn't anything new.

But I like the music I listen to and even if my tastes change over time I won't forget who I drew inspiration from and why.

[renzoip]

I'm not sure why bands such as Meshuggah, AAL, Periphery, Tesseract, and the like of bands associated with the term "Djent" are being classified as progressive. Are they considered a new wave of prog metal, a separate branch of prog metal, or just wrongly categorized bands?


Anyways, I'll leave you guys with some good old progressive metal, as I understand it (and love it).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lf23Vr504v4

[Harry]

I can't be the only one that thinks this thread has just about run its course

[DLG]

Originally Posted by The_Mop

Even meshuggah, in my opinion, have become incredibly stagnant. I don't think they've made anything really worth listening to since Nothing.

If you invented the wheel, I think you are allowed to focus on making changes to the wheel and trying to take it in various directions in terms of design and performance as the years go by, instead of being obligated to reinvent it.

Meshuggah have their sound and that's what they do. The fact that there is no existing precursor, generally speaking, for their style, means that they can't really experiment too much. A band like Opeth can take their style into prog rock, death metal, black metal, doom metal, directions without getting a "wtf" from everyone, because their music is informed by all these genres.

Meshuggah doesn't have that luxury.