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Unread 01-03-2012, 07:35 PM   #1
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My first 7 string. Tone help needed :)

Hey guys, I'm new to this forum and all so I'd appreciate it if I could get some help or some info to get where I want.

My Gear: (I'm using numbers as my settings, not o' clock positions)
Agile Septor 725 RN -> TS9: Drive: 0, Tone: 5, Level: 10 -> ISP Noise Decimator: Threshold -30 -> Peavey 6505+ 112 Resonance & Presence: 8, High: 7, Mid: 3.5, Low: 9.5, Pre: 6.5. The Post is normally 2-4 sometimes 5 but it has a lot of feedback and such at that volume.
Everything is stock by the way.

I played a 6 string for a while, but wanted to get into playing a 7. This is my first 7 as I said and my first guitar with active pickups as well. I don't really know much about 7s or how to achieve the tone I want with one yet.

The tone I want to achieve is a tight bottom that doesn't feedback during the stops (Like Periphery's New Groove) but still have a good tone for leads like Born of Osiris. That's the best I can explain it I guess.

Thanks in advance!
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Unread 01-03-2012, 10:42 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GregMcCracken View Post
Hey guys, I'm new to this forum and all so I'd appreciate it if I could get some help or some info to get where I want.

My Gear: (I'm using numbers as my settings, not o' clock positions)
Agile Septor 725 RN -> TS9: Drive: 0, Tone: 5, Level: 10 -> ISP Noise Decimator: Threshold -30 -> Peavey 6505+ 112 Resonance & Presence: 8, High: 7, Mid: 3.5, Low: 9.5, Pre: 6.5. The Post is normally 2-4 sometimes 5 but it has a lot of feedback and such at that volume.
Everything is stock by the way.

I played a 6 string for a while, but wanted to get into playing a 7. This is my first 7 as I said and my first guitar with active pickups as well. I don't really know much about 7s or how to achieve the tone I want with one yet.

The tone I want to achieve is a tight bottom that doesn't feedback during the stops (Like Periphery's New Groove) but still have a good tone for leads like Born of Osiris. That's the best I can explain it I guess.

Thanks in advance!
hope this helps:
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Unread 01-03-2012, 10:44 PM   #3
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i can tell you right off the bat to turn down the lows
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Unread 01-03-2012, 10:58 PM   #4
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Your GAIN doesn't need to be that high with a boost.

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Unread 01-03-2012, 11:00 PM   #5
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also your mids are scooped which you don't want. you'll want to boost the mids some what.
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Unread 01-04-2012, 03:11 AM   #6
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I'd go guitar -> ISP -> TS-9, it should be cleaner that way.


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Unread 01-04-2012, 05:53 AM   #7
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Alright, thanks guys.
So turn the gain and lows down, bump the mids up, and go guitar -> ISP. Also from watching that video getting two noise gates and a compressor should keep the tone tight but still have sustain right?
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Unread 01-04-2012, 06:24 AM   #8
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Well, I would say that you should turn your pres and res down to about 4, then drop the lows to 4, put the mids at 6, and then put the highs so that you have enough bass. More importantly, drop your gain to about 3 or 4 - it will give you a much more crunchy, clear sound.

You can also try the rhythm channel, which gives a much clearer sound. Try crunch mode on, and all settings at 6.

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Unread 01-04-2012, 02:49 PM   #9
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Your mids are fine, jesus. The 5150/6505 (ESPECIALLY the plus) is an extremely midrangey amp, they are fine where they are...in fact, screw that.


USE YOUR EAR! Forget ALL of these peoples advice on here. I can't believe people are actually trying to tell you how to EQ your amp just by looking at the settings you gave...Seriously?


If it sounds good with everything on 10, fine, who cares? Its all about you and what you want. You are not going to have to vastly re EQ your amp just because you have a 7 string. Example: My schecter 7 string blackjack atx, has an EMG 81-7 in the bridge. My Les Paul, and my ALDER BODIED RR-1T has bare knuckle pickups in them. My Jackson (let alone my les paul) Absolutely destroy the schecter as far as bottom end goes. Actives tend to be extremely tight, and have very little "sub bass' response compared to passives.

All im saying is use your ear. Your settings are probably fine, maybe ease up on the lows a bit to keep things tight but again, USE YOUR EAR.
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Unread 01-04-2012, 03:11 PM   #10
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Quote:
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The 5150/6505 (ESPECIALLY the plus) is an extremely midrangey amp, they are fine where they are...in fact, screw that.


USE YOUR EAR! Forget ALL of these peoples advice on here. I can't believe people are actually trying to tell you how to EQ your amp just by looking at the settings you gave...Seriously?
While the first part may be true, I hope you can see how inflammitory your post is. Many people have played that amp, and therefore we have an idea of how it sounds and how the EQ responds. Yes, use your ears- but it's not wrong to draw on some wisdom and experience of others who've played a particular amp and who knows how it sounds.

Having the OD helps, but for tight low end on a 5150/6505 be sure to tame the lows and resonance and not let yourself turn them too high. Yeah, that cab throbbing sounds awesome- but the lower you go in pitch the more important it becomes to emphasize the mid-range frequencies and roll off the bass. What tuning do you use?

Lowering the gain will also help in a couple areas, like helping tighten the tone and cut noise. With a boost (especially with the volume on it maxed) I would recommend you stay below 4.5-5 on the lead channel, and 6.5-7 on the rhythm channel (w/ crunch and bright engaged). The 5150/6505's have plenty of gain.

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Unread 01-04-2012, 03:48 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by JPhoenix19 View Post
While the first part may be true, I hope you can see how inflammitory your post is. Many people have played that amp, and therefore we have an idea of how it sounds and how the EQ responds. Yes, use your ears- but it's not wrong to draw on some wisdom and experience of others who've played a particular amp and who knows how it sounds.

Having the OD helps, but for tight low end on a 5150/6505 be sure to tame the lows and resonance and not let yourself turn them too high. Yeah, that cab throbbing sounds awesome- but the lower you go in pitch the more important it becomes to emphasize the mid-range frequencies and roll off the bass. What tuning do you use?

Lowering the gain will also help in a couple areas, like helping tighten the tone and cut noise. With a boost (especially with the volume on it maxed) I would recommend you stay below 4.5-5 on the lead channel, and 6.5-7 on the rhythm channel (w/ crunch and bright engaged). The 5150/6505's have plenty of gain.
Thanks for taking the time to help me out.
I normally tune it to (From low to high) A#, C#, G#, C#, F#, A#, D#. Sometimes Bb standard and Drop G# but yeah. I actually tweaked it around and I like my tone a lot more now, thanks to everyone that helped
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Unread 01-04-2012, 04:09 PM   #12
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Your mids are fine, jesus. The 5150/6505 (ESPECIALLY the plus) is an extremely midrangey amp, they are fine where they are...in fact, screw that.

USE YOUR EAR! Forget ALL of these peoples advice on here. I can't believe people are actually trying to tell you how to EQ your amp just by looking at the settings you gave...Seriously?

All im saying is use your ear. Your settings are probably fine, maybe ease up on the lows a bit to keep things tight but again, USE YOUR EAR.
dude do you know what this forum is for? of course he's going to use his ears but people can help guide him in the right direction and maybe save him a little time. i was playing a 6505 last friday and if he's looking for a djent type of tone then his mids are way to low.
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Unread 01-04-2012, 05:23 PM   #13
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You should use your ears to eq........

.........There are some guidelines to get a good tone however.... Setting you gain, res, pres, treble and bass to max, with no mids, will probably not sound good to anyone

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Unread 01-04-2012, 05:29 PM   #14
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Yeah, that cab throbbing sounds awesome- but the lower you go in pitch the more important it becomes to emphasize the mid-range frequencies and roll off the bass.
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Unread 01-04-2012, 06:10 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by pitbulltodd View Post
dude do you know what this forum is for? of course he's going to use his ears but people can help guide him in the right direction and maybe save him a little time. i was playing a 6505 last friday and if he's looking for a djent type of tone then his mids are way to low.


i am quite aware of what this forum is for, thanks...But I still find it crazy someone is trying to tell someone how to EQ you an amp just by a post on a guitar forum...thats asinine. I've owned 4 5150s, and yes, while what some of you have said may have some meaning to it, I've never once asked how I "should" set an amp, I've just used my ear. White Chapel recorded with both the bass and res on 10...How do I know that? I was at audiohammer studios when the album was being recorded...Does that mean that live you should do that? Of course not but hey, maybe it would work with your setup? (cab, guitar, pickups, mic etc), you use your ear to re EQ...What sounds good in some situations may sound bad in others. Hence the reason I was saying, how could someone tell this guy his mids are too low, or his bass is too high etc? If I set my mids above 5 on one of my mid heavy guitars, it sounds extremely nasally, while others, it is just right. You somehow missed my point that I was trying to make.....
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Unread 01-04-2012, 06:19 PM   #16
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i am quite aware of what this forum is for, thanks...But I still find it crazy someone is trying to tell someone how to EQ you an amp just by a post on a guitar forum...thats asinine. I've owned 4 5150s, and yes, while what some of you have said may have some meaning to it, I've never once asked how I "should" set an amp, I've just used my ear. White Chapel recorded with both the bass and res on 10...How do I know that? I was at audiohammer studios when the album was being recorded...Does that mean that live you should do that? Of course not but hey, maybe it would work with your setup? (cab, guitar, pickups, mic etc), you use your ear to re EQ...What sounds good in some situations may sound bad in others. Hence the reason I was saying, how could someone tell this guy his mids are too low, or his bass is too high etc? If I set my mids above 5 on one of my mid heavy guitars, it sounds extremely nasally, while others, it is just right. You somehow missed my point that I was trying to make.....
With all due respect, I think the OP is asking for tone help.
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Unread 01-04-2012, 06:20 PM   #17
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With all due respect, I think the OP is asking for tone help.
I understand, and I wasnt trying to "not" help him at all. I felt I was trying to help him to be honest! Using your ear is always best, that was my point. EQ your amp blindfolded if you can..People have so many preconceived notions on how an amp should be set, or how the knobs should sound in what position etc, I was just trying to get the OP way from that mindset, because it really is hard to get away from it, once you've started down that path. I have some crazy settings at times on my diezel herbert, but hey, it sounds phenominal!
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Unread 01-04-2012, 06:32 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VESmedic View Post
i am quite aware of what this forum is for, thanks...But I still find it crazy someone is trying to tell someone how to EQ you an amp just by a post on a guitar forum...thats asinine. I've owned 4 5150s, and yes, while what some of you have said may have some meaning to it, I've never once asked how I "should" set an amp, I've just used my ear. White Chapel recorded with both the bass and res on 10...How do I know that? I was at audiohammer studios when the album was being recorded...Does that mean that live you should do that? Of course not but hey, maybe it would work with your setup? (cab, guitar, pickups, mic etc), you use your ear to re EQ...What sounds good in some situations may sound bad in others. Hence the reason I was saying, how could someone tell this guy his mids are too low, or his bass is too high etc? If I set my mids above 5 on one of my mid heavy guitars, it sounds extremely nasally, while others, it is just right. You somehow missed my point that I was trying to make.....
Even with a mid heavy guitar, I still find the mids at 5 on a 5150 to be pretty damn scooped Your ears will decieve you, because the human ear does not natrually pick up mid frequencies, as it is not adjusted to them, because most noises we hear are low and high based frequencies. Youre probably adjusted to the scooped sound, and find it to be pretty mid heavy in your hears when in others its nasty as ..... Now mind you, there is a point youll hit when your guitar tone will stay sounding muddy because there is way too much mids. When I look back at my old guitar tone (which I thought had PLENTY of mids at the time) its uber scooped in my opinion. Once my band recruited a guitarist for some time (hes no longer with us) who used an 8 string, which you HAVE to know how to eq properly if you dont want your tone to be shit on the low F# or E, I learned how to properly EQ. MIDS ARE YOUR FRIEND! Keep adding more mids here and there and playing with that amount switching between cleans and distorted until you become used to the amount of mids in your amp. If you hit a point where you find you cant adjust to the mids and it just ALWAYS sounds muddy, then youve hit that point where its just too much and you can roll the mids back a bit Thats what I did for my tone. I used to think he had an INSANE amount of mids, then I just decided to crank up my mids and got adjusted to the frequency and absolutely loved the tone. Then we went to practice a week later and I noticed I was staying in that point of muddiness, so I just rolled the mids back to about the perfect amount, and I couldnt be happier with my tone I have just a touch more mids than Accept on the song balls to the wall if that gives you any clue of where im at. I cut perfectly in the live mix, and my tone isnt harsh as ....
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Unread 01-04-2012, 07:03 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VESmedic View Post
i am quite aware of what this forum is for, thanks...But I still find it crazy someone is trying to tell someone how to EQ you an amp just by a post on a guitar forum...thats asinine. I've owned 4 5150s, and yes, while what some of you have said may have some meaning to it, I've never once asked how I "should" set an amp, I've just used my ear. White Chapel recorded with both the bass and res on 10...How do I know that? I was at audiohammer studios when the album was being recorded...Does that mean that live you should do that? Of course not but hey, maybe it would work with your setup? (cab, guitar, pickups, mic etc), you use your ear to re EQ...What sounds good in some situations may sound bad in others. Hence the reason I was saying, how could someone tell this guy his mids are too low, or his bass is too high etc? If I set my mids above 5 on one of my mid heavy guitars, it sounds extremely nasally, while others, it is just right. You somehow missed my point that I was trying to make.....
so if anyone asks for amp settings on a guitar forum the answer should be i can't help you, you're on your own, close your eyes and just start turning knobs? the settings that people give each other on guitar forums are suggestions that will hopefully get someone closer to the tone they want. maybe it will maybe it won't but hopefully in the end it will save a person sometime when compared to starting from scratch.
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Unread 01-04-2012, 07:12 PM   #20
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Yes I was asking for tone help and info. hahaha. I do use my ears, that's how I got the tone I wanted for my 6 string (Which sounds terrible on my 7 IMO) I just wanted to see what works for people on here and see if they could share some knowledge on how to achieve the tone I was aiming for
Turns out yes, it sounds better on my 7 with less gain and bass but with more mids. So thanks for pointing me in the right direction guys, (Plugging the guitar straight into my ISP worked well too) also thanks for being true and telling me to use my ears, which are obviously the best tool. Maybe I could've found the problem with my ears myself but I guess I was lazy, which isn't too good either :P
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Unread 01-04-2012, 07:17 PM   #21
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its not always easy to just follow wour ears. you know what you want to hear. but your ears wont tell you exactly "how" to eq. alot of times 7s just have more bass, even tuned the same a 6ers turning down on the low end usually helps actually bring out the low end of a 7.
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Unread 01-04-2012, 07:54 PM   #22
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Obviously OP has USED his ears to get where he is at, now it seems he is seeking help.

5150's/6505's and their chinese clones are generic amps and this forum has a pretty good understanding of how to dial them in.

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Unread 01-04-2012, 09:22 PM   #23
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It all depends on your ears and tonestack
. different settings for different styles, different amps etc. In terms of mids I used to be always hesitent about scooping my mids and having the right amount. Now it depends what I feel is the tone I wanna use. Currently my mids are scooped and I feel I get the best sound for the style I playl, which is bottom heavy scooped d hi gain type stuff(death metal). It also benefits my leads. But I have my gain below5 and for some reason i have a tendency to have my mids to be the same as my gain(so it's all below 5).but then again i have pedal for signal boosting and compressors and a tone noise gated.

A live situation is much different. Your focus is to just cut through and still sound heavy in terms of rhythm. You also might want to have your leads sound good,but that's all subjective. Just toy around with your gear. You'll find your sound. If not after a period of time(over a month)get a new amp or stuff like pedals and pre amps to supplement the sound you want.

IMO a BoO guitar tone is very similar to a meshuggah tone(especially on the discovery). I get a sort of vaulty aggressive djent chaosphere era tone when I have high mids gain(5 at least)
.this is all on the amp through a line 6. Since im using a rg7321, the pickup swich is not on bridge or middle. Its between middle and bridge. Thats how i do it with stick pickups. Also having alot of compression or/and noisegate benefits too. If you get some woof from the bottom end, turn down the bass a bit. A heavy attack is always required. Thats all i can say for the tone you want. There are alot of meshuggah tone threads so search around forums and they might help

I'm trying to type on a phone so don't get all derp herp if you see mistakes
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Unread 01-06-2012, 02:14 PM   #24
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When I tried the amp, I did prefer the Crunch channel's tonal character to the lead channel's. Lot more clarity, tighter and more dynamic.
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