[noodles]

Since this discussion kinda got started in the Stiletto thread, I thought it would be a good idea for a new thread.

Anyone who plays a high gain tube amp is familiar with the problem in finding useable clean tone. Either the amp is flat out lousy at cleans (like Marshall), or it has problems balancing the volume with the other channels, forcing you to compromise your tone (like Mesa).

This led me to thinking about preamp gain and the strength of a guitar signal.

None of us are strangers to the idea of using a "booster" in front of the amp: drop a Tube Screamer (or the like), with gain on zero, level maxed, and tone to suit. It heats up the signal before the preamp and, as Emril would say, kicks it up a notch. BAM!

What about the reverse idea? Would it be feasible to use a pedal as an attenuator, dropping the level of the signal before the preamp, making it much harder to distort? Then you could set the channels on the amp up the way they sound best, eliminating the possibility of the clean channel clipping. If you're looking for pristine cleans, overdrive is your worst enemy.

Mike dropped a MIDI loop pedal into his rig last week: it has true bypass, and he can control whether it is on/off with MIDI program changes. He has a Tube Screamer connected to it, and it comes on whenever he is using his lead or rhythm channel. It seems to me the same thing could be done for the cleans, with something like a Boss EQ pedal. The you'd have your attenuator for cleans, and your booster for distortion.

My biggest question would be unwanted hum/hiss that is prone to crop up when the signal to noise ratio gets too low. However, there are two points in my favor here: 1) there is no distortion to make the matter worse, and 2) this would strictly be for live playing, making noise less of a factor.

What do you guys think? Would it work? Am I on to something, or is it a good idea that is just not practical? Since I don't know much about tube preamps, I'm not sure how it would react.

[Jason]

If I get what your saying..wouldn't this drop the overall volume tho on the cleans??

[Leon]

Originally Posted by noodles

What about the reverse idea? Would it be feasible to use a pedal as an attenuator, dropping the level of the signal before the preamp, making it much harder to distort?

these come standard on every guitar. the volume knob

or, you could wire up an ON/ON mini switch onto your guitar to connect a small value resistor into the signal path when you flick the switch.

[technomancer]

[Leon]

i didn't mean for it to come off as a joke, it's just that sometimes little simple things can be overlooked. i'll sometimes fuck with my presence controls, completely forgetting that there's a little guy called The Tone right next to my Mr Volume.

[mefrommiddleearth]

or you could use a guitar with a les paul style control layout then you could set the tone and volume on one pickup to suit cleans and the other to suit distortion sure it means your stuck useing one particular pickup to get the best out of each sound but as I would imagine most people on here(being metalheads) prefering the sharper sound of the bridge pup for distortion and the less "twangy" sound of the neck pup for cleans I can't see it being much of a problem. (then again I could be compleatly off)

[Jerich]

wow Noodles you think a lot man.... this idea and answer is the same ! "separate amps for each task"....I have never used the same amp for cleans as i do for leads/crunch......My opinion and i am sure some will disagree but solid state sounds great for cleans...so even a single rack space amp could be A/B/Y together for amp switching. I use three amps and a/b/y them one for cleans one for dis one for solos...yes it means more gear but most digital gear doesn't cut through a live band.....considering i play in a few bands and use a different Rig for each band I have planty to mess with....i do not know if i answered you or just started a whole other topic...

[Jason]

Noodles..just buy a roland jazz chorus

[The Dark Wolf]

^ Fucker stole my idea.

Dave, for the record, your idea would work. I've done it before myself, using an EQ pedal set to shape and lower the output for a more pleasing tone. I think I was experimenting with trying to make a humbucker sound sorta single-coli-ish.

How efficiently it would work, well, I suppose that depends on teh rig and your setup. Using something like an EQ pedal that allows you to decrease overall level, while adding EQ might even be a great idea, since somethimes humbuckers get a bit muddy/rolled off on cleans. (Although not really the Jazz, in my experience.)

[bulb]

Originally Posted by noodles

Mike dropped a MIDI loop pedal into his rig last week: it has true bypass, and he can control whether it is on/off with MIDI program changes.

Totally OT but what kind of pedal is it, where can i get it and how much would it cost? Its pretty much EXACTLY what im looking for my rig!

as for you, just buy a vht pitbull haha!