[777]

Right so im lookin into one of these as my first tube amp but theur have been mixed reviews of em so what im lookin for is , your opinions on

-What its good for
-What its not good for
-Which one ?
-Videos/Clips of em

obviously the head+cab option is gna ber more expensive therefore il be longer savin but i just wana knw what the deal is about these cz they seem to be goin pretty cheep in comparison to other tube heads/combos

thanks

[7 Dying Trees]

head + cab is better as you get to mix and match what cabs you want in my opinion. Also, if you are rehearsing you can just carry the head and plug into a cab at your destination.

as for 6505 vs 6505+ I don't know, never spent much time with either so i wouldn't be able to tell the difference as well as some of the other guys.

Also with a head you can get a 4x12, 2x12 or a 1x12, whatever you want!

oh, and the 6505 is basically the rebranded 5150 amp

[777]

yeah a fair few good points made there man, some cabs r bloody expensive tho, and i have heard that for some reason the 5150>6505 tho this is my very first tube amp EVER so chances arei couldnt tell atall

[Apophis]

Separate head plus cab is better, you can always shitch to some other cab if you want tonal difference based on cap
I think 6505+ is more versatile, cause it has more chanels than 6505

[Crucified]

the 5150 2 or the 6505+ are terrible compared to the 6505/5150. i don't know what they changed but there isn't as much gain and the eq sounds different. You can still get decent sounds but if you have the option go for the 5150 or 6505

[7 Dying Trees]

6505 and 5150 are the same amp. Period. Although people will always claim the original run was better. Now, with the 5150/6505 there are a few mods you do to them to make them sound really good.

Cab wise, I know there are tons of expensive cabs, and lord knows I myself spend enough on gear, but, I've always like marshall cabs, and they aren't expensive at all. Plus, I'd always buy cabs second hand pretty much

I wouldn't worry about getting an orange/vader/etc cab, i mean, i don't!

[777]

Originally Posted by Crucified

the 5150 2 or the 6505+ are terrible compared to the 6505/5150. i don't know what they changed but there isn't as much gain and the eq sounds different.

this comes from personal experience? terrible is a very strong word :\

so the 6505+ has like one more channel or something?

i was thinkin of goin plain 6505 head

[FoxZero]

I say go with a 6505 because I hear it has a much better clean channel than the 5150 (which is known for bad cleans).

I've been dying to try one myself and I think I found a store that packs em so I'll let ya know what I think.

[Stitch]

Originally Posted by Crucified

the 5150 2 or the 6505+ are terrible compared to the 6505/5150. i don't know what they changed but there isn't as much gain and the eq sounds different. You can still get decent sounds but if you have the option go for the 5150 or 6505

Utter shite.

The 5150 and the 6505 are IDENTICAL. The 6505 name was introduced when Eddie Van Halen took his endorsement contract from Peavey to Fender, and taht included the 5150 name. (6505 comes from the anniversary of Peavey's inception - 1965-2005).

The red channel on the 5150/6505 is mind blowingly good. Sweet, huge and gainy, but with the capabilities to be hard edged or silky smooth depending on pickup choice and how you dial it in. The 'green' channel on the 5150/6505 is NOT a true clean channel - it is more apt as an orange - it will do cleans with the preamp gain down and the master up, but it isnt Fender glassy territory.

The 5150II and the 6505+ are again new and old versions of the same. They are functionally idential to a) each other (the 5150II has EXACTLY the same circuit as the 6505+) and the basic preamps are almost identical - the ONLY exceptionbeing that the 5150II/6505+ contains one extra preamp tube (for a total of six 12AX7's) that allow it to handle true cleans. While it doesn't have more channels, the 5150II/6505+ comes with a three way footswitch (as opposed to a two-way on the 5150/6505) that adds a 'crunch' boost besides the channel and fx loop switches. The crunch boost basically gives you lead 'rhythm' and cleans all at the tap of a foot. Also, the 5150II/6505+ has individual EQ's for each channel, including seperate Resonance and PResence controls.

The 5150/6505 is an incredible amp, but its partners, the 5150II/6505+ have enough extra that they are worth the extra outlay IMO. I wish I'd saved up extra for the 6505+.

FINALLY - the reason 5150's and 5150II's sound 'better' than the 6505/6505+ are for two main reasons:
i)The 5150 is over a decade old now. You won't find one with stock tubes. And non-stock tubes are much better than the stock Ruby Tubes that come with the 6505 = this is where the main discrepancy lies. Second hand 5150's are just better equipped. The stock Ruby's aren't great - they aren't awful or unusable by any means...just not great.

ii) 5150 owners are the real problem here. Second hand 5150's and 6505's traditionally have lost a fair bit of value. However, since demand for them is consistent (everyone wants one at some point) the prices are stable - but not as high as other resale values for similar amps - its a buyers market. You will NEVER have a problem selling a 5150 though. When the 6505 came out 5150 owners the world over took it upon themselves to advertise their amp as 'the original version, before they remade it as the 6505' and this has, through time, like a game of chinese whispers turned into the age old 'original=better tone' argument. Think of whining Fender/Giibson players and you see what has happened here.

Hope that helps dude!

[poisonelvis]

[budda]

I like having maximum tonal options - i'd get the 6505+. seperate EQ. why is this good? a decent rhythm EQ might not make for the best lead EQ with the 6505.. 6505+ means more options. single EQ makes me leery.. i've had seperate EQ's per channel since i bought my 2nd amp.

[777]

Stitch that was great man thanks good food for though =]

[kmanick]

Stitch nails that pretty much right on the money.
the only other thing I'd add is that the
5150 combos and biased a little hotter than the heads are so they sound a little different, a
little warmer annd smoother. Sme people like em better (like me) some don't. With a hotter bias
the green channel cleans up a lot nicer than on the head. Good tubes go a long way as well.
I just sold my 5150 combo a couple of weeks ago and I'm already looking around at heads to replace it
(6505+ this time I want the seperate EQ's this time).
Great amps, everyone into metal basically owns one at one point or another
during their playing careers.

[WarriorOfMetal]

Originally Posted by Stitch

Utter shite.

The 5150 and the 6505 are IDENTICAL. The 6505 name was introduced when Eddie Van Halen took his endorsement contract from Peavey to Fender, and taht included the 5150 name. (6505 comes from the anniversary of Peavey's inception - 1965-2005).

The red channel on the 5150/6505 is mind blowingly good. Sweet, huge and gainy, but with the capabilities to be hard edged or silky smooth depending on pickup choice and how you dial it in. The 'green' channel on the 5150/6505 is NOT a true clean channel - it is more apt as an orange - it will do cleans with the preamp gain down and the master up, but it isnt Fender glassy territory.

The 5150II and the 6505+ are again new and old versions of the same. They are functionally idential to a) each other (the 5150II has EXACTLY the same circuit as the 6505+) and the basic preamps are almost identical - the ONLY exceptionbeing that the 5150II/6505+ contains one extra preamp tube (for a total of six 12AX7's) that allow it to handle true cleans. While it doesn't have more channels, the 5150II/6505+ comes with a three way footswitch (as opposed to a two-way on the 5150/6505) that adds a 'crunch' boost besides the channel and fx loop switches. The crunch boost basically gives you lead 'rhythm' and cleans all at the tap of a foot. Also, the 5150II/6505+ has individual EQ's for each channel, including seperate Resonance and PResence controls.

The 5150/6505 is an incredible amp, but its partners, the 5150II/6505+ have enough extra that they are worth the extra outlay IMO. I wish I'd saved up extra for the 6505+.

FINALLY - the reason 5150's and 5150II's sound 'better' than the 6505/6505+ are for two main reasons:
i)The 5150 is over a decade old now. You won't find one with stock tubes. And non-stock tubes are much better than the stock Ruby Tubes that come with the 6505 = this is where the main discrepancy lies. Second hand 5150's are just better equipped. The stock Ruby's aren't great - they aren't awful or unusable by any means...just not great.

ii) 5150 owners are the real problem here. Second hand 5150's and 6505's traditionally have lost a fair bit of value. However, since demand for them is consistent (everyone wants one at some point) the prices are stable - but not as high as other resale values for similar amps - its a buyers market. You will NEVER have a problem selling a 5150 though. When the 6505 came out 5150 owners the world over took it upon themselves to advertise their amp as 'the original version, before they remade it as the 6505' and this has, through time, like a game of chinese whispers turned into the age old 'original=better tone' argument. Think of whining Fender/Giibson players and you see what has happened here.

Hope that helps dude!

the guy you were replying to didn't say that the 5150 was different from the 6505, but that the 6505+/5150II are "worse" than the 6505/5150

[Stitch]

Originally Posted by WarriorOfMetal

the guy you were replying to didn't say that the 5150 was different from the 6505, but that the 6505+/5150II are "worse" than the 6505/5150

Which I covered in my fourth paragraph. I figured I might as well start from the start.

[Crucified]

Please reread and try again.
I said the 5150 and 6505 were my personal choice as i find the 5150 2 and 6505+ sound different enough from the 5150/6505. So really we said the same things except you liked the 5150 2 and 6505 + more.

Originally Posted by Stitch

Utter shite.

The 5150 and the 6505 are IDENTICAL. The 6505 name was introduced when Eddie Van Halen took his endorsement contract from Peavey to Fender, and taht included the 5150 name. (6505 comes from the anniversary of Peavey's inception - 1965-2005).

The red channel on the 5150/6505 is mind blowingly good. Sweet, huge and gainy, but with the capabilities to be hard edged or silky smooth depending on pickup choice and how you dial it in. The 'green' channel on the 5150/6505 is NOT a true clean channel - it is more apt as an orange - it will do cleans with the preamp gain down and the master up, but it isnt Fender glassy territory.

The 5150II and the 6505+ are again new and old versions of the same. They are functionally idential to a) each other (the 5150II has EXACTLY the same circuit as the 6505+) and the basic preamps are almost identical - the ONLY exceptionbeing that the 5150II/6505+ contains one extra preamp tube (for a total of six 12AX7's) that allow it to handle true cleans. While it doesn't have more channels, the 5150II/6505+ comes with a three way footswitch (as opposed to a two-way on the 5150/6505) that adds a 'crunch' boost besides the channel and fx loop switches. The crunch boost basically gives you lead 'rhythm' and cleans all at the tap of a foot. Also, the 5150II/6505+ has individual EQ's for each channel, including seperate Resonance and PResence controls.

The 5150/6505 is an incredible amp, but its partners, the 5150II/6505+ have enough extra that they are worth the extra outlay IMO. I wish I'd saved up extra for the 6505+.

FINALLY - the reason 5150's and 5150II's sound 'better' than the 6505/6505+ are for two main reasons:
i)The 5150 is over a decade old now. You won't find one with stock tubes. And non-stock tubes are much better than the stock Ruby Tubes that come with the 6505 = this is where the main discrepancy lies. Second hand 5150's are just better equipped. The stock Ruby's aren't great - they aren't awful or unusable by any means...just not great.

ii) 5150 owners are the real problem here. Second hand 5150's and 6505's traditionally have lost a fair bit of value. However, since demand for them is consistent (everyone wants one at some point) the prices are stable - but not as high as other resale values for similar amps - its a buyers market. You will NEVER have a problem selling a 5150 though. When the 6505 came out 5150 owners the world over took it upon themselves to advertise their amp as 'the original version, before they remade it as the 6505' and this has, through time, like a game of chinese whispers turned into the age old 'original=better tone' argument. Think of whining Fender/Giibson players and you see what has happened here.

Hope that helps dude!

[Stitch]

Originally Posted by Crucified

Please reread and try again.
I said the 5150 and 6505 were my personal choice as i find the 5150 2 and 6505+ sound different enough from the 5150/6505. So really we said the same things except you liked the 5150 2 and 6505 + more.

No, you said that the 6505+ and 5150II were 'terrible compared to the 6505 and 5150'.

My post wasn't about what you said, it was expanding on why the amps are identical, yet are viewed as sounding 'different'. The First channels are different, but the lead channels are identical between both.

Sorry if it came across as aggressive - I'm just oh so tired of misinformation being spread about these amps.

[Crucified]

Alright, its all good. I honestly do hear a sound difference between the lead channels having played both extensively.

[Stitch]

Personal preference I guess.

I can't hear a difference, and we had one of each side by side for a while at work, and I'd plug into those four or five times a day at work.

[777]

which one u got at the moment stitchy? and is 6505+ the better option

[Stitch]

I currently have a 6505. Seriously dude, its a fucking stellar amp. If you can stretch to it, then look at the 6505+.

It all depends which way your budget falls - you can get an Engl Fireball for a touch more than a 6505 new, a Powerball for a bit more than a 6505+, and you can get a 5150 or 5150II for about half the new prices of the 6505/6505+.

[777]

damn stitch u rule, your knowledge is most appreciated

[warlock7strEMG]

i personally love the 5150/6505 amps. i actually prefer them over many of the much higher priced amps on the market. while they arent the most versatile amps in the world, they are very very good at the tones that they do generate. they sound especially good with something other than the matching peavey cab. i prefer the mesa cabs for these amps, or really anything with v30s.

the rhythm channel, though it doesnt make for the best clean channel, does great with the crunch and bright button engaged for pulling off the marshall plexi tone...has a pretty huge sound to it. some metal guys even use this channel for their main rhythm channel by turning the channel gain all the way up and adding a boost of some sort, usually an ibanez ts9 tubescreamer or a maxon 808.

the lead channel is what most metal guys use these amps for though, has gain for day, also has a very raw, ballsy, aggressive and tight tone, makin for a very clear articulate metal rhythm tone; also sounds great for leads. this is my favorite channel on these amps, it sounds great with my EMG 707 equipped warlock 7 string. these amps work great for 7 strings and low tuning in general.

one of the many things i love about these amps is the presence and resonance controls of the power amp section. the presence control is good for adding articulation to your tone and shaping the highs but you have the be careful not to turn it up too high as it will make your amp sound too trebly and shrill, esp when the treble is turned up a decent amount. some people turn the presence all the way up and the treble all the way down or vise versa, which u can easily get away with doin either but i find its best to find a balance between the 2.

the resonance control is good for thickening up the low end and controlling how tight it is. just like the presence, this is something you have to be careful with, as turning it up too much will make the lows somewhat muddy and loose feeling. its best to find a good balance between the amount of bass and resonance used. dialed in correctly, the resonance helps give these amps a huge ballsy tone.

if you get one of these amps, i would definately recommend the 6505+/5150 II over the regular 6505/5150. the +/II rhythm channel actually works as a usable clean channel when the crunch is not engaged, also the rhythm and lead channels have their own independant EQ, presence and resonance controls making for maximum flexibility. some people say the lead channel on the +/II doesnt have the tone of the regular, but i think its pretty close. it doesnt quite have as much gain, but it only a tad less, still has more than enough. dialed in correctly, the only real difference i find is that the +/II is a bit tighter sounding overall the regular. the +/II also has an adjustable p0wer tube bias so u can have an amp technician bias the tubes hotter for an ever better tone whereas the regular ones have to be modded to have this done, as the bias on those is fixed.

[Stitch]

Originally Posted by warlock7strEMG

i personally love the 5150/6505 amps. i actually prefer them over many of the much higher priced amps on the market. while they arent the most versatile amps in the world, they are very very good at the tones that they do generate. they sound especially good with something other than the matching peavey cab. i prefer the mesa cabs for these amps, or really anything with v30s.

the rhythm channel, though it doesnt make for the best clean channel, does great with the crunch and bright button engaged for pulling off the marshall plexi tone...has a pretty huge sound to it. some metal guys even use this channel for their main rhythm channel by turning the channel gain all the way up and adding a boost of some sort, usually an ibanez ts9 tubescreamer or a maxon 808.

the lead channel is what most metal guys use these amps for though, has gain for day, also has a very raw, ballsy, aggressive and tight tone, makin for a very clear articulate metal rhythm tone; also sounds great for leads. this is my favorite channel on these amps, it sounds great with my EMG 707 equipped warlock 7 string. these amps work great for 7 strings and low tuning in general.

one of the many things i love about these amps is the presence and resonance controls of the power amp section. the presence control is good for adding articulation to your tone and shaping the highs but you have the be careful not to turn it up too high as it will make your amp sound too trebly and shrill, esp when the treble is turned up a decent amount. some people turn the presence all the way up and the treble all the way down or vise versa, which u can easily get away with doin either but i find its best to find a balance between the 2.

the resonance control is good for thickening up the low end and controlling how tight it is. just like the presence, this is something you have to be careful with, as turning it up too much will make the lows somewhat muddy and loose feeling. its best to find a good balance between the amount of bass and resonance used. dialed in correctly, the resonance helps give these amps a huge ballsy tone.

if you get one of these amps, i would definately recommend the 6505+/5150 II over the regular 6505/5150. the +/II rhythm channel actually works as a usable clean channel when the crunch is not engaged, also the rhythm and lead channels have their own independant EQ, presence and resonance controls making for maximum flexibility. some people say the lead channel on the +/II doesnt have the tone of the regular, but i think its pretty close. it doesnt quite have as much gain, but it only a tad less, still has more than enough. dialed in correctly, the only real difference i find is that the +/II is a bit tighter sounding overall the regular. the +/II also has an adjustable p0wer tube bias so u can have an amp technician bias the tubes hotter for an ever better tone whereas the regular ones have to be modded to have this done, as the bias on those is fixed.

All of that was correct except your last two points.

Rep for knowing what you speak about though!

[Roobubba]

I have a 5150-II, which I got second hand a few months ago.

I absolutely love it! Just sorting out some kick-arse speakers to go with it, as the stock 5150 cab speakers (Sheffield 1200s) can't quite handle the low A tuning at very high volumes. I'm talking about VERY high volumes here, and it's not a major issue, just a very mild slackening of the bass notes. At any standard volume (I'm the only guitarist in a LOUD band, and it's USUALLY fine!), they are great, really tight and controlled - but the amp itself is just superb

MySpace.com - 13Gauge - Oxford, UK - Hardcore / Screamo / Healing & EasyListening - www.myspace.com/13gauge for our stuff. It's not 7-string, but it is downtuned 6 string in A-E-A-D-F#-B, so it might as well be 7 string

I do use the clean channel a bit, but not a huge amount. That said, I'm glad I got the 5150-II, as the cleans on the 5150 aren't as good.
Oh, and if you're in the states, you can get fjamods.com to mod your 5150/5150-II in a variety of ways. With a decent set of preamp tubes and some killer speakers, you really shouldn't *need* to do this

Roo