[Roland777]

I've been sketching quite a lot on an extended range bass lately, and with this, I've run into the problem of instrument length. It's basically a 5-string bass tuned to F#, 35 to 39-inch scale. As you can imagine, it's a pretty long scale to start off with, which would result in a rather huge and bulky guitar, should you go for a traditional design. Therefore, I've been thinking about a headless tuning system of my own. The reason why is because all the systems that I've looked at so far either require double ball-end strings, or dont work with fanned frets, or both. This one is based on an individual saddle, works with standard strings (only issue being, as with all strung instruments, the length of the string) and in essence only has one custom component. What I'm asking here however is, am I wasting my time here? Is there already a headless tuning system that has individual saddles and works with standard strings?

[bostjan]

Sounds cool. Maybe try a patent search? I'm not sure if there are too many good ways to check.

4" is kind of a lot of fanning, no? I'd like to try it to find out. Always wanted a real extended scale bass. I don't think many companies ever made them, though.

What body shape are you going for? An S-shape would give good center-point strap pin position as well as a counter-weight on the far end.

[Roland777]

Glad you're interested. The best way I could describe it without showing it (which I will as soon as I get close to a scanner) would be a hybrid between a Carvin bass (upper body wing) and Ibanez BTB (lower body wing) along with a very special tail cutout. Looks very nice in my own opinion (which you could call biased).
As far as the four inch fanning goes, I figure it's rather acceptable - add two inches on the bridge end, two inches at the nut end. Durero has a "32-"36 fanning on his sevenstring which apparently plays great in his own words.

[Desecrated]

http://www.knuckleguitarworks.com/1.html

Have you seen these basses.

[Roland777]

Yes. A straight-fretted 39-inch scale would be harder to play, harder to find a cover for, harder to find strings for and with that design, a lot heavier, than the design I have in mind. You'd could at least use normal strings on the first four strings on the fanned headless one I have in mind (35, 36, 37 and 38 inches respectively) as opposed to the straight-fretted Knuckle Quake.

[jtm45]

Don't know if this will be of any use to you but 'Status' in the UK sell separate bass saddles and four,five and six string headless 'Nut' type things.
I think (?) their nuts will take normal strings (clamped) or double-ball strings.
You can't link directly to the spares page but this will take you to the front page and then go to the 'Spare Parts' link in the 'Online Shop' and they're there under 'Bridges',i think?
Check it out here;
http://www.status-graphite.com/statu...mes/frame1.htm

[Roland777]

Originally Posted by jtm45

Don't know if this will be of any use to you but 'Status' in the UK sell separate bass saddles and four,five and six string headless 'Nut' type things.
I think (?) their nuts will take normal strings (clamped) or double-ball strings.
You can't link directly to the spares page but this will take you to the front page and then go to the 'Spare Parts' link in the 'Online Shop' and they're there under 'Bridges',i think?
Check it out here;
http://www.status-graphite.com/statu...mes/frame1.htm

I saw a similiar unit at ABM, however like you mentioned, it's unsure whether it works with normal strings, and it requires a separate clamp system if it does. What I had in mind has the ball-end at the headstock and only one custom component. So far, I'll keep refining my design.

[gojira]

Originally Posted by Roland777

I saw a similiar unit at ABM, however like you mentioned, it's unsure whether it works with normal strings, and it requires a separate clamp system if it does. What I had in mind has the ball-end at the headstock and only one custom component. So far, I'll keep refining my design.

The abm stuff does not require double ball ended strings it can take them - but also incorporates a loccking nut on the headpiece itself - it's not seperate - however!!!!!

any headless sytem you put on a fanned instrument is going to require a custom headpiece - trust me.....(oh god the pain) and that is going to cost you - however several companies make single headless bridges for bass- far moreso than for guitar, and the designs seem to be better.

You need to basically make a locking nut type device that sits on the end of the neck where the headpiece would sit - ABM or any other brand for that matter do allow standard strings - but like i said - the headpiece isn't gonna work on your fanned bass.

Also roland - consider why you would want a headless system - i personally like the idea of a smaller more compact instrument that can be tuned without reaching the headstock - however others like the double ended aproach because it reduces the amount of string stretching that occurs - even moreso on the floyd rose 2 system.

email me and we'll talk about a headpiece if you are serious.

so yes in short - systems already exist - many of them - and no because they rely on locking nut that is designed around your fanning.

[dpm]

Gojira and I have discussed this pretty extensively. A bass system would actually be a bit easier than guitar because the dimensions are a bit bigger, things aren't as closely spaced. I also now have a CNC place willing and able to make parts for me. The problem is the cost. At a guess, I wouldn't be surprised if a one-off headless system could cost you up to $1000 or more purely for machining.

[Roland777]

Originally Posted by gojira

Also roland - consider why you would want a headless system - i personally like the idea of a smaller more compact instrument that can be tuned without reaching the headstock - however others like the double ended aproach because it reduces the amount of string stretching that occurs - even moreso on the floyd rose 2 system.

Why would I want a headless tuning system? Well, I wanted a bass to go with my fanned 8 - any sketches I drew up resulted in a huge and bulky bass. At that point, it's better on pretty much all levels to try to aim for a new solution - and I figure that a headless tuning system is it. With the elimination of the headstock, you've got 6 or 7 inches to spare - 4 of those go to the extended scale, which means that you still end up with an instrument that is two or three inches shorter than a regular "35 scale bass. Also, no major body redesigns are necessary, since the headstock is removed. If anything, the bass is going to be a tad more body-heavy than your average bass.
I'll email the sketches to you as soon as I get home.

Originally Posted by dpm

The problem is the cost. At a guess, I wouldn't be surprised if a one-off headless system could cost you up to $1000 or more purely for machining.

So there we go! Start the advertising. Anyone interested in a compact extended range bass designed to be tuned to F#?